tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post6590347515664526390..comments2023-03-26T02:30:44.066-07:00Comments on Mosaic Of Pain: MOP Comments (Page 10)Cris Aguilarhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10950908651660523514noreply@blogger.comBlogger141125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-89634723625011467552008-07-30T18:09:00.000-07:002008-07-30T18:09:00.000-07:00------------- Admin Note ----------I am turning th...------------- Admin Note ----------<BR/><BR/>I am turning the page. Please click the following page in order to read and or comment.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://mosaicofpaincontinues.blogspot.com/2008/07/mop-comments-page-11.html" REL="nofollow">MOP Comments (Pg 11)</A><BR><BR/><BR/>....Cris Aguilarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10950908651660523514noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-14623891264491694842008-07-30T16:44:00.000-07:002008-07-30T16:44:00.000-07:00Here is the deal the MOP heads will say everyone i...<I>Here is the deal the MOP heads will say everyone in leadership at Mosaic is prideful, drunks, liars, etc.</I><BR/><BR/>...uhhh please document. And once again an apology would suffice.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-5920071334011696852008-07-30T16:16:00.000-07:002008-07-30T16:16:00.000-07:00Outside Looking In Says,sounds like this Jose guy ...Outside Looking In Says,<BR/><BR/>sounds like this Jose guy didn't get much discipleship. just converted and told he should be different now.<BR/><BR/>don't you people over at Mosaic know that it takes years sometimes to overcome certain sins?<BR/><BR/>maybe you should slow down on the worldwide expansion and take care of your house here at home. sounds like you are sort of coming apart at the seems here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-35658549621274913482008-07-30T16:08:00.000-07:002008-07-30T16:08:00.000-07:00Actually, nobody at MOP believes, "...everyone in ...Actually, nobody at MOP believes, <I>"...everyone in leadership at Mosaic is prideful, drunks, liars, etc."</I><BR/><BR/>We believe they are redeemed and growing believers just like the rest of us. <BR/><BR/>The question is, Do the leaders at Mosaic think they are beyond reproach?<BR/><BR/>And, just as the homosexual feels, "it is not a sin and it is acceptable in God's eyes."<BR/><BR/>That is the essence of this blog when it comes to the prideful leader of Mosaic. He feels his ego-centered ministry is not a sin in God's eyes as well. Why is he still accepted?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-47962465375430793182008-07-30T14:03:00.000-07:002008-07-30T14:03:00.000-07:00Here is the deal the MOP heads will say everyone i...Here is the deal the MOP heads will say everyone in leadership at Mosaic is prideful, drunks, liars, etc.<BR/>Despite that will be the reaction to the post, I will still try to bring some light to the situation.<BR/>Yes, no one at Mosaic is without sin.<BR/>There is a difference between "Hey I lied, it was wrong, God forgive me, I do not want to be a liar" vs. "Hey I am a liar, I was born a liar, don't be so liarphobic, stop picking on liars, accept us as we are."<BR/>It is not that being a homosexual is worst than a liar, or a drunk, or a greedy person.<BR/>it's the fact the greedy, liar, or drunk will admit it is a sin and they want to stop/repent.<BR/>The homosexual in this situation feels it is not a sin and it is acceptable in God's eyes.<BR/>Mosaic still loves & accepts people who embrace their sin and excuse it. The only problem comes when these people hear their sin in small groups or at the main gathering being told what it is - sin.<BR/>They then feel rejected, but no one has personally rejected them - it is just the conviction of the scriptures being taught.<BR/>Hope that clears it up - and yes we know Mosaic leadership is not without faults & sin.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-5125440157204047892008-07-30T13:41:00.000-07:002008-07-30T13:41:00.000-07:00I have a question. Why is it always, "Erwin and th...I have a question. Why is it always, "Erwin and the small group leaders will teach that your life will be more beautiful if you choose to leave some of these lifestyles."<BR/><BR/>Why isn't it Jesus and the small group leaders? Or, Jesus teaches etc...<BR/><BR/>You guys sound a bit like the cult of Erwin, no?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-36078672501850158382008-07-30T11:54:00.000-07:002008-07-30T11:54:00.000-07:00>He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mos...>He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mosaic loves him but does not accept homosexuality.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Do you guys accept gluttons? How about all the fat people still there?<BR/><BR/>Do you guys accept substance abuse? How about all of the alcoholics and prescription drug addicts that every church has?<BR/><BR/>Do you guys accept sexual immorality? How about the pre-marital sex going on in your youth group and singles group? (it happens)<BR/><BR/>Do you guys accept liars? How about all the little white lies and blatant lies that happen daily in every church?<BR/><BR/>Does Mosaic tolerate the sin of pride? - Okay, the answer to that one is obvious.<BR/><BR/>You reject the homosexual because you are afraid and ignorant of this sin. Not because God wants you to.<BR/><BR/>Agreed, the Bible does not support homosexuality, but why are you so selective in what sin is worse than any other? Can you answer that question?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-733826350432994152008-07-30T11:29:00.000-07:002008-07-30T11:29:00.000-07:00"He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mosaic...<I>"He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mosaic loves him but does not accept homosexuality."</I><BR/><BR/>Come on Mosiac, you guys know you are homophobic, just like 99% of the church today. When an earlier post went up talking about Rupert Murdoch you guys had all kinds of excuses to defend the greed and power hungriness of this man.<BR/><BR/>But, oh the mention of homosexuality and you start talking about "lifestyle", "love the sinner, but reject the sin".<BR/><BR/>Be honest, this is the one sin that the American church (not Jesus) can NOT tolerate.<BR/><BR/>I began to think that Jose "left" Mosiac, now that I know he has a struggle with homosexuality, I KNOW he was pushed out.<BR/><BR/>Jose, welcome to the hell known as Mosaic of Pain. A place very similar to the Twilight Zone, but far more real and painful.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-29914347118202916552008-07-30T09:17:00.001-07:002008-07-30T09:17:00.001-07:00He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mosaic ...<I>He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mosaic loves him but does not accept homosexuality.</I><BR/><BR/>You know an apology would be suffice.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-76093421339142563802008-07-30T09:17:00.000-07:002008-07-30T09:17:00.000-07:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-17784558991096512762008-07-30T07:22:00.000-07:002008-07-30T07:22:00.000-07:00He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mosaic ...He is hurt because his spiritual family at Mosaic loves him but does not accept homosexuality. Mosaic has great small groups that are all about discipleship. Now Jesus in those three years of discipleship asked his disciples to feed the poor, clean up after them, do manual labor, travel long distances, and a number of other serving type activities. Serving others is part of discipleship. Long all night talks about your life around the scriptures and prayer on the front porch at a Mosaic small group is also part of discipleship. Mosaic to me has a good balance in their discipleship. If Peter would have decided his sin of denying Christ was a acceptable lifestyle, he could of ended up like Judas. Even jesus had disciples that left feeling they were not accepted & loved.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-78454642457072749032008-07-30T03:06:00.000-07:002008-07-30T03:06:00.000-07:00I didn’t want to post the comments about Jose abov...I didn’t want to post the comments about Jose above considering it was so off point and was obviously meant to let us all realize how “sinful” Jose is and how because of his sin we need to put him over to the side and discount what he has written. They first mentioned his “lifestyle” and now a few posts later come right out and let us all know he is a “proud homosexual”. This is so sad on so many levels. <BR/><BR/>Jose mentioned concerns such as being disillusioned after the requirements of serving vs. being loved and the low level of discipleship as well as how they spent their funds (specifically furnishings at their Pasadena Headquarters). They didn’t write about those issues but they wrote about how hurt they were considering how much they love him. Yeah, many of us have experienced that kind of Mosaic love, which happens to also be known as Mosaic of Pain. They just forgot to write their name along with that I love you as Jose mentioned above. What about the issues he wrote about?? How about calling him?? How about not treating him poorly along the way especially when he is saying he needs discipleship and he has/had concerns about finances. What else can you ask of a young believer?? Oh, yeah, I guess you guys want the type that will just shut up and serve. Been there, done that but at some point someone it simply doesn’t jive.<BR/><BR/>MOP is practically on autopilot. I do almost everything via cell phone and I also have two others that help me keep up with the comments if I get behind. Most days this takes very little of my time. Today is the exception. I have had several calls to others trying to decide if I should let these comments go up as well as thinking and praying about this. <BR/><BR/>In the end, the main reason I decided to go ahead and post the comment is because of Jose’s own words. He wrote in his first comment above that he has followed this site for the last year and a half. Considering this, then he understands how muddy and cruel some have been. He also has a blog and understands the workings of the blog world and how public it is. Jose was willing to use his name and tell us his experience and with that comes the risk of someone being hurtful. To be honest I am often surprised how hurtful some can be knowing that a person has already been hurt. <BR/><BR/>Where’s the love?Cris Aguilarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10950908651660523514noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-78779652192711708872008-07-29T22:19:00.000-07:002008-07-29T22:19:00.000-07:00AmenAmenAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-28734330526026971232008-07-29T12:26:00.000-07:002008-07-29T12:26:00.000-07:00Jose is a proud homosexual. Mosaic loves & ac...Jose is a proud homosexual. Mosaic loves & accepts homosexuals but does believe it is a sinful lifestyle. Mosaic does not see it as a relationship vs. a theology choice. The church desires to have relationships with all types of people - drunks, thieves, liars, etc. All types of people are welcomed and will be loved at Mosaic. But through the teaching & washing of the Word - Erwin and the small group leaders will teach that your life will be more beautiful if you choose to leave some of these lifestyles. So I guess if you have a problem with this - the MOP's could surely point you to a more "loving" church that will just accept you as you want to be.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-57441738074947831322008-07-29T10:58:00.000-07:002008-07-29T10:58:00.000-07:00"Jose you've just been moppedized"No idea what tha...<I>"Jose you've just been moppedized"</I><BR/><BR/>No idea what that means, but I can only assume it means that Jose has been publicly honest with his experience with a less than Christ like church (similar to Paul in dealing with the church of Corinth).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-84276478193670478532008-07-29T09:50:00.000-07:002008-07-29T09:50:00.000-07:00Jose you've just been moppedizedJose you've just been moppedizedAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-35786886605400604062008-07-29T08:09:00.000-07:002008-07-29T08:09:00.000-07:00>This group has never been investigated by the ...>This group has never been investigated by the FBI as many of the other hate groups that make threats against Mosaic.<BR/><BR/>Same tactic that Erwin & Eric tried when they called the police on David for starting MOP. The police laughed it off as Church politics.<BR/><BR/>Maybe you can copy and paste in a new comment all the "hate" comments and "threats" you have found on this site.<BR/><BR/>If you do not, we can safely assume you are just following in the footsteps of your leaders - <I>Church politics.</I>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-76090159895002273962008-07-29T07:59:00.000-07:002008-07-29T07:59:00.000-07:00"Hundreds of people love you (present tense) at Mo...<I>"Hundreds of people love you (present tense) at Mosaic..."</I><BR/><BR/>With friends like this..?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-71796070590693206382008-07-29T07:54:00.000-07:002008-07-29T07:54:00.000-07:00I personally choose to embrace my brother in Chris...I personally choose to embrace my brother in Christ, no matter his choices and "lifestyle" decisions, rather than some petty theologies or assumptions of what is right and wrong.<BR/><BR/>Sorry, but I would rather follow Jesus on this one.<BR/><BR/>Eddie MarshallAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-30548829261404187712008-07-29T07:50:00.000-07:002008-07-29T07:50:00.000-07:00"I know you well from our time at Mosaic. It reall...<I>"I know you well from our time at Mosaic. It really hurts me that you would write these things. Hundreds of people love you (present tense) at Mosaic, and have always loved you. That love never stopped and probably never will. People here still miss you and feel your loss to this day. Please do not confuse people not loving you with people not willing to give up their theology in order to accept certain lifestyles. We wish you all the best, and our prayers are with you as you journey to find another community. I just don't know how you could say those things about so many people that care for you"</I><BR/><BR/>A perfect example of what we are talking about on this site.<BR/><BR/>Rather than go to this brother in Christ and have a coffee or just show some real love, the poster chooses to imply that Jose left because he is in some kind of "lifestyle" sin. Leaving everyone on here to imagine the worst. Either that person is malicious or completely ignorant to the subtilties of relationship.<BR/><BR/>You know what they say, "As the leader goes..."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-43809143021102752452008-07-29T05:16:00.000-07:002008-07-29T05:16:00.000-07:00One of the things that bother me about Mosaic is w...One of the things that bother me about Mosaic is when they push their propaganda about their community being about love. Jose, in my opinion you have justifications for moving on to another church. I don't believe your personal assessment about Mosaic is unfair or wrong, I believe you called it as it is. I think if anything is going to be said by anyone about Mosaic that will make Mosaic look like it is not the ideal Godly community, then someone from Mosaic will step in to do damage control. I believe Mosaic is pretty arrogant about themselves, always pushing and puffing up their virtues. Makes me sick!<BR/><BR/>Willis QuanAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-79408924500411319832008-07-29T01:06:00.000-07:002008-07-29T01:06:00.000-07:00While tempted to want to address whoever this pers...While tempted to want to address whoever this person that claims to know me well, and feels hurt by my comments posted here, I won't bother. If you know me so well and really care to discuss your feelings, then you know how to contact me. Otherwise, as long as you so cowardly choose to hide behind "anonymous" your identity and words mean nothing to me. I, on the other hand, have nothing to hide and can sign my name next to my comments.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-38390074554409498952008-07-29T00:19:00.000-07:002008-07-29T00:19:00.000-07:00People here still miss you and feel your loss to t...<I>People here still miss you and feel your loss to this day. Please do not confuse people not loving you with people not willing to give up their theology in order to accept certain lifestyles.</I><BR/><BR/>Its difficult to do church. When a church puffs out its chest and forget those in the body who need to be discipled. Hey why doesn't Erwin do a book on discipleship. The disciples evangelized, but they also discipled because Jesus discipled them for 3 years. How could a church who proclaims to do church so right get it so wrong. Is it a surprise that there isn't enough people capable at Mosaic to reach out and guide these brothers and sisters. Jose, go and find a church that will love you but also willing to spend the time to work with you. I've been a christian for years and I still need guidance and help. Alot. <BR/>Matt 5<BR/><BR/>P.S. That last post was the ugliest one posted on this site Cris. Poison. An ugly glimpse and reminder of some who attend Mosaic. Blinded Blinded peopleAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-44471149466281373272008-07-28T21:23:00.000-07:002008-07-28T21:23:00.000-07:00Jose,I know you well from our time at Mosaic. It ...Jose,<BR/><BR/>I know you well from our time at Mosaic. It really hurts me that you would write these things. Hundreds of people love you (present tense) at Mosaic, and have always loved you. That love never stopped and probably never will. People here still miss you and feel your loss to this day. Please do not confuse people not loving you with people not willing to give up their theology in order to accept certain lifestyles. We wish you all the best, and our prayers are with you as you journey to find another community. I just don't know how you could say those things about so many people that care for youAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4816732093186928774.post-13558596147130491832008-07-28T11:55:00.000-07:002008-07-28T11:55:00.000-07:00Jose,Your correct. This site is not only for membe...Jose,<BR/>Your correct. This site is not only for members from the Brady days. Actually many of the readers and members of MOP came after the name change.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com